Sample Relay Challenge (Max's Bentley Piano)


#1

Here’s a tread to get started with pulling together a virtual instrument from by community from Christian’s latest video:

Link to the recording session https://we.tl/t-nnavBo2g4l

From the video I got the following things on the todo list (may be more)

  • Curate the best takes and flatten into continuous audio file
  • Make a stereo track from the left/right Coles mics
  • Normalise the peak across all tracks
  • Cut up into files and name appropriately
  • Noise Reduce individual files
  • Create Kontakt Instrument
  • Create other instruments (EXS24/SFZ/etc)

Would be great fun to do this as a relay - anyone want to pick up a step they are interested in doing?


#2

Can’t wait to see how this turns out!


#3

Hey! I’m interested in working on the curation. Best tracks and flattening to continuous file.
: )
I’m home now with a fair amount of time to work on them this week. In fact, if I had a link to the file, I’d be happy to work on them right now (Monday).
Let me guess: the samples are in the file I haven’t downloaded yet? Working on that now.


#4

Count me in for the Kontakt instrument :slight_smile: although not until weekend.
What functionality would be expected?


#5

Great stuff! First step would be to get the basic layers working and then figure out the round robin and release triggers. Beyond this, I can imagine some cool controls to adjust the balance of the two mics and maybe something to control the “afterglow” vs standard release triggers. Certainly plenty to get stuck into!


#6

Everything should be in the download linked above. Think it’s in Logic format.


#7

Here’s a crazy off topic question. I’m in Windows. Whenever I download a zip file and unpack it, I see two files. One is labeled MACOS. I have always assumed that this means there is a duplicate set of sound files and delete it.
After I get my edited samples together and upload them, I will only have one set. (All WAV files, of course)
What does a Mac user see? Do I need to do something differently?
: )
I’m getting to work on those samples now.


#8

another question: the samples are all labeled L or R. But we don’t want stereo files out of all of them? Would it be best to work on them in pairs then? There is only one set of Coles files.


#9

It’s a feature of the macOS filesystem. It’s pretty much useless for Windows users, so you need not keep it. It’s sort of a relic from the old days as a way to manage resource forking as far as I understand


#10

I think it’ll be easier to deal with a stereo bounce off the L and R samples.


#11

Well, I grouped them so right now they are all getting edited together, not bounced to stereo yet. No problem
I have separated everything to notes now. Wondering what the random F#0 was for.
Assuming it is all organized as the others were, first Forte, second Piano, third RTs.
I’m having a bit of trouble with the release triggers – but fear not, I will get it sorted.
It is my intention to separate all of the individual piano hits (for the round robin, there are three or more for every note sampled), choose which ones sound the most consistent with each other. I can bounce them all separately, but Christian indicated he would like to have them all on the same line – So, I will line them up and bounce them that way. They will need to be cut apart again at some point. Right now, I have fancy color coding too, I can export that as a file protools can read, I think. I am not renaming the individual files right now because bouncing them will only change it all again.
: )


#12

Posted it as a YouTube-comment but can report it back in this thread as well: I did a refresh of the Cyclebox FuxPad adding mod wheel xfade and sent the new NKI to Christian via Dropbox.


#13

You’ve asked about sample auto-naming and how people deal with it. AFAIK there is no convenient way of naming sample by it’s root note, but I have an intention of making my own piece of software to do such thing (tho I would not be able to finish it for this project). There are several ways you can go about it. In some audio editors (and DAWs) there is a way of exporting files by the name of marker. Here is a short tutorial on how I go about it in RX7 (PS. As a new user I can not add more than 1 image to the post… Found out when finished writing this)

Cutting

Spoiler
  • Open file in RX (duh). Make it comfortable to work with (adjust vertical waveform scale, spectrum/waveform blend). you can also Ctrl+scroll in top overview lane to make waveform there more visible
  • Open Markers window by Alt+M, Spectrum window by Alt+R (i’m a Windows slut, sorry)
  • In main menu go to Edit, make sure Snap is on, and Snap to is only set to Zero Crossings (Alt+[E,T,N,E,T,Z], aka “type etnetz holding Alt while having nothing selected”)
  • Select the start of a sample piece to make a marker. It is important to select a zero crossing point and being consistent with timing of samples. One good way is to select those right in front of spectrogram “glow”
  • Select that point (not a region) and create marker by pressing M
  • Now it is easy to mark a key of that region – just hover over the spectum window and find a fundamental, then rename it in markers list (cursor snaps to peaks there, and it is pretty accurate)
  • After doing this for all pieces, it is simple to Export Regions to Files (Ctrl+Alt+E). Export starts from first marker. Export ends on the end of a file. Exported files are named as region name first, then file name you choose (with no space between). Markers of the same name get indexes (eg. “e2”, “e2 2”, “e2 3”…)

Renaming

Spoiler
  • You need a Total Commander to make file names looking fancy
  • Select files to be renamed (make sure all programs that could be using those are closed) and open Batch Rename Tool (Ctrl+M)
  • To make Kontakt automatically map velocity ranges there is an option to set highest and lowest velo in file name. You can do it by replacing velo layer mark (in my case “v1” and “v2”) with velo ranges (0-95 and 96-127)
    There is a way to export all file names to external .txt file, edit it and apply to file names. I found it useful one day. Also I see people using regex (regular expressions) to replace file names in even cooler way (I think it is even possible to write a regex to replace flat notes with sharp notes, because Kontakt does not understand flats) (anyone here???)
  • Apply renaming!

Kontakt madness

Spoiler
  • Open Kontakt instrument for editing, open Mapping Editor
  • Drag and drop samples of one round-robin with no release triggers into editor. Their region sizes do not mater
  • Right click on selected regions and open Auto Map - Setup
  • Set it up to map lowest and highest velocity values, as well as the root key, click apply
  • Change Make Root Key to Make Low Key, apply
  • Change Make Low Key to Make High Key, apply
  • Fin!

Bonus tips?

Shhh-poiler
  • In RX use G and T keys to quickly switch between Grabbing the timeline or making Time selection
  • In marker window, press a yellow playhead icon to transport to marker faster
  • To prevent exporting big chunk of silence just cut it out! You can always save a RX Document from File menu, original files would me intact (unless you are a “Ctrl+S anytime” person; but no worries, RX back-ups original files)
  • Another way is to create regions at problematic places
  • IL Edison can do regions too! As well as FL Studio itself (don’t have one, cannot test one…)

Yeah, if you have any questions, feel free to ask them, I will update this post if needed!

For Russian users

Если вы хотите отдельно обсудить это дело со мной, у меня, как и у всех, есть страничка в ВК и Телега

I am not good at English, sorry :upside_down_face:


#14

File format question: the given samples were AIFF. My DAW just exported WAV 48 32 bit.
I was exporting an AAF file, and I need to know if that is the correct export or I need to do something else.
There will be multiple versions in the zip file, I think. Plus notes.
Today.
: )


#15

AIFF and WAV are pretty much the same type of files (only difference being the way of encoding raw data). feel free to use any conversion software to convert them


#16

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mQjyP2DyFFUlD1HamNxNuO5mIX9Oxj15

Here it is. AFF file for protools and logic. a copy of my Studio One song.
I believe the AFF file has audio in it. the sample folder of 24bit WAVs is a standalone. Screen shot will help the notes make more sense, I think.
: )

PS: if you want a different format or something else, please let me know! Happy to do what I can.


#17

Oh, Imma Ableton guy and it seems I can’t help you here :frowning:


#18

You can certainly use the standard WAV files, just won’t have all the markers. The screenshot will help you sort it out, if you want.
I hope Stephan weighs in, or maybe Christian, but the next step would be to comp samples to use where there are multiple choices. (I found I couldn’t figure out what he was hearing that prompted him to want another take and I didn’t want to get it wrong!) D#5 in particular.
And decide where the last set of release triggers go. And I think separating the release triggers.
And then normalizing. And then the de-noise-ing. This last won’t be nearly as troublesome as the air piano.
Maybe some discussion about all of this before anyone gets to work first?
One of my friends is an Abelton guy. Check your manual; maybe you can import AAF files, too.
: )


#19

I know you are probably all tired of me, but I’ve been thinking about this whole project and I have a couple of general thougths that I think would benefit everyone.
I walk almost four miles every day (most of it is on mostly level ground, though) and I think. A lot.

Why are we on our own? Well, Christian knows way more than I do about sample libraries and assembling instruments, but everything he knows is proprietary. It all belongs to Spitfire, so he CAN’T tell us more. I suspect he has already said as much as he can in the context of the videos.
We really do need to figure out how to get this done ourselves.

Why do we want to? For the fun of it, certainly, and the satisfaction of hearing some way cool music played with an instrument I created for myself. And for myself, I believe that anything worth doing is worth doing well. If it’s going out into the world with my name on it, it needs to be a quality product.
Why are you doing it?

Is there a bigger story? Yes. Christian keeps mentioning “A Listers” checking out Pianobook. Consider that it is for the instruments as much as our sample compositions. So, again, it behooves us to assemble a quality product.

No pressure or anything ; )

I also have some ideas for streamlining the editing process (organizing the samples like I’ve been doing). Unfortunately, it will always be the first step, I think. OR, how can we organize our sample recordings to facilitate the initial editing?

I think this also needs to be a conversation more than just a project with a goal so we can create a process as we create the instruments.
: )
Thanks!

PS: Thought of a use for Kate. Sliced up the track and spread it out so it can serve for markers – one more wav file. Discovered we are missing a note from the sequence: A4. ?!?


#20

Christian has often talked about one day curating a selection of samples from the community and packaging them up. I think this is a great idea - but why only Christian? The community itself could curate an “anthology” from the library and present it as it’s own library. Could we create the equivalent of the Ólafur Arnalds or Hauschka Toolkit? A small set of pianos and complementary instruments/pads that together could be used to create a particular style?